Steel Caged PG1 Gearbox Bearings and Seals

[Null_Byte]

10 roller is the X/NASP spec only.

That is an impressive input bearing failure there John

[E_T_V]

Very impressive and the first one I've seen, Its usually the diff bearings that pack up first way before the input shaft bearings lose their lube supply.

[MGJohn]

Very impressive and the first one I've seen, Its usually the diff bearings that pack up first way before the input shaft bearings lose their lube supply.

That's nothing, here's another cracker. Apparently these cars have weak gearboxes... they certainly do not last long with no lubricant... Look Mum, no teeth on me constant mesh pinions... Toothless wonders on 4th and 5th ... :~



... and the worst I've ever seen :~

10 roller is the X/NASP spec only.

That is an impressive input bearing failure there John

Bought a 620ti about six years ago with known gearbox problems ~ yes differential bearings. I drained the box prior to inspection ~ no oil...

Vacuum cleaning the car later, I found a chitty from Santa Pod Raceway for the car showing a reasonable 1/4 mile time down the strip not long before I bought it ... with no oil in the gearbox. No bluddy wonder.

How folks can let things get like that is beyond me, but, they do...
..

[MGJohn]

Having reassembled a Diesel Spec + TorSen for another Rover enthusiast a couple of weeks ago, I thought that would be the last PG1 I would be working on for a while. Then my son who uses his high mileage 620ti tells me his car has lost 5th gear. He has two spare ( worn ) 620ti PG1s with "bearing troubles" apparently so I split the casings on one and discovered the various bearings I could see without removing the Differential were all good condition steel caged items. They looked and "felt" fine. More checks to follow. I'll check the hidden differential bearing tomorrow to see how that shapes up. So far so good for that box. I'll get that checked and when he removes the faulty one on his car, this will be ready to go straight on.

I then turned my attention to the other PG1 which was the original one that came with the car when he got it about seven years ago. The nearside Differential bearing was cageless and as soon as I split the casings, the full extent of the damage cause by the worn and broken up bearing became apparent. A number of teeth on the Crown Wheel were broken off.

The bearing on the top of the countershaft was interesting because it was steel caged. It's the one with the groove in the outer race to accomadate the C-Snap ring. As far as I know, this gearbox has never been worked on since it left the factory. Thus, the steel caged bearing could be the original factory fitment. Here's a close up showing the details :~



An NTN OPG2 ... ?? I wonder if these can still be obtained.

By the way, the broken off pieces of the Crown Wheel's teeth were lodged in the top of the gearbox having been thrust there as the Crown Wheel rotated :~



This is what I removed :~



This is the broken up Nearside Differential Bearing which allowed the Differential to oscillate out of true and break off those Crown wheel teeth :~



Moral: At the first noisy signs of Differential Bearing wear, stop using the car and get it repaired before much more serious damage occurs.

By the way MGJohn, when working single handed, how do you hold the prongs on the C-Snap ring apart to allow the casings to be split. Like this ... ... :~



Where there's a will, there's a way...

[o0o0oo000o]

The Top bearings with the c ring notch can still be obtained in steel format, they are all stocked honda gearbox item lines , I managed to source most of the bearings from the usa from honda part suppliers.

[MGJohn]

The Top bearings with the c ring notch can still be obtained in steel format, they are all stocked honda gearbox item lines , I managed to source most of the bearings from the usa from honda part suppliers.

Thanks for that o0o0oo000o. Any USA prices available? The last one I bought locally came in an MG-R package and had nylon ball cages. I could do with a small supply of these although all the PG1 boxes I've ever worked on, that particular bearing rarely needs replacing.

[Null_Byte]

The Top bearings with the c ring notch can still be obtained in steel format, they are all stocked honda gearbox item lines , I managed to source most of the bearings from the usa from honda part suppliers.

Thanks for that o0o0oo000o. Any USA prices available? The last one I bought locally came in an MG-R package and had nylon ball cages. I could do with a small supply of these although all the PG1 boxes I've ever worked on, that particular bearing rarely needs replacing.

I have no problem in sourcing these in the UK John, steel caged for X and U.

The only ones that don't seem to be available in steel are the roller races and the 3/LDJK25 for the NASP. If these are available in steel cage and I can get the part numbers I can see about sourcing them.

[Null_Byte]

Just as an update, I have got some new X spec roller bearings in with steel cages.





Still not found the U spec roller in steel, but will keep looking.

[amacrobie]

Ooh, is that one of mine ?!

[Null_Byte]

Ooh, is that one of mine ?!

It will be shortly, just boxing it up now

[sameer_swrt]

how much will cost me delvering to israel.
mine is 620ti 1999.
i need the 5 bearings as well as the seals
cheers

*edit by admin to remove VIN number

[Remobilise]

Nice pics again John.

Good source on the bearings at a very decent cost.

Kev

[amacrobie]

Massive thanks for the bearing & seal set; box is reassembled and going on on Wednesday (along with exhaust and, hopefully, rebuilt turbo)

[Angelo]

Hi,

I have a Lotus 340R, I have done an engine conversion, a Duratec 2.3L with all the upgrades to push about 300bhp. I need to upgrade the PG1 gearbox, can you help?

I believe I need some steel caged bearings, what else?

Thanks,
Angelo.

[djwilma]

Hi,

I have a Lotus 340R, I have done an engine conversion, a Duratec 2.3L with all the upgrades to push about 300bhp. I need to upgrade the PG1 gearbox, can you help?

I believe I need some steel caged bearings, what else?

Thanks,
Angelo.

Angelo, basically thats all you need other than some new drive shaft seals

[Angelo]

Where do I buy them from?

[peteT16]

Jon can supply bearings and seals (Null_Byte)

[Null_Byte]

Where do I buy them from?

Me hopefully, I can supply all bearings and seals as required.

[stefaclese]

Depends which bell housing you need to use, as all K series PG1's are NASP spec. With a little work they can be modified to accept U spec shafts, iirc you need to fit a U spec mainshaft roller bearing to the bell housing but unless you drill and tap a couple of holes you can't use the retainer plate found in U spec gearboxes. I think there was something about it in Mitus' K turbo Mini thread.

I'll be on the look out for a NASP rebuild kit soon, I gather the prices are still the same as at the top of page 1 Jon?

[djwilma]

Depends which bell housing you need to use, as all K series PG1's are NASP spec. With a little work they can be modified to accept U spec shafts, iirc you need to fit a U spec mainshaft roller bearing to the bell housing but unless you drill and tap a couple of holes you can't use the retainer plate found in U spec gearboxes. I think there was something about it in Mitus' K turbo Mini thread.

I'll be on the look out for a NASP rebuild kit soon, I gather the prices are still the same as at the top of page 1 Jon?

Steph thats not entirely correft if you want to use the k series bellhousing and uprated pg1 you simply swap the bell housings.

There is no need to modify anything other than shims

Metro had a k7 uprated box with k series bell housing

[stefaclese]

The U spec shaft is 2mm thicker in diameter though isn't it? In which case it wouldn't fit the NASP/X spec bearing in the bell housing. You sure you weren't using an X spec K7?

[djwilma]

Nope uprated pg1 with k series bell housing

[Null_Byte]

The U spec shaft is 2mm thicker in diameter though isn't it? In which case it wouldn't fit the NASP/X spec bearing in the bell housing. You sure you weren't using an X spec K7?

No but it is possible to fit the U spec bearing and use the U spec shaft. You will be missing the retainer plate, although I suppose nothing stops you drilling and tapping the threads to retrofit this if requried.

Not entirely sure it gains you much over just using an X spec bell housing though.

[aleks-id]

can you sell me complete set of bearings and seals with delivery to Moscow, Russia?
MG ZR 160 2002

[edward22]

have to say i used nuill byte and he was very helpfull.

came to my rescue lol

[acr]

HI

Can you supply 2 sets of NASP bearings?

Kind regards
Anders

[42jester]

Just a quick thankyou and recommendation for the service received from Null_Byte

received a set of U spec bearings very promptly, great service,

credit where its due !!

[mrrigma]

Calling Null_Byte! Are you around? Would like to get hold of some of your bearings

[1994 BRG Coupe]

Send him a PM with your requirements and he will get back to you

[mrrigma]

Thanks have already done so.

Cheers,

Rob.

[skidder]

Just read this post with interest as I want to change the driveshaft oil seals on my early 1992 220 Turbo Coupe.

Can anyone confirm whether or not the driveshaft oil seals (early type for my car) are the same for both the NASP & Turbo, as I can only seem to find the one part number listed.

Cheers, Ian

[stefaclese]

They're the same.

[MGJohn]

If you have difficulty obtaining a pair, I have a pair of OE MG-R ones still in their wrappings. I bought them for my 220 coupe turbo gearbox when I rebuilt it and never fitted them as those already fitted were just fine. Last I heard, my car is in good hands and no longer carries UK registration plates.

[skidder]

They're the same.

Thanks for confirming that for me.

If you have difficulty obtaining a pair, I have a pair of OE MG-R ones still in their wrappings. I bought them for my 220 coupe turbo gearbox when I rebuilt it and never fitted them as those already fitted were just fine. Last I heard, my car is in good hands and no longer carries UK registration plates.

Cheers for the offer John, but I've already got them. Just wanted to check they were the right ones!

[skidder]

Would it be advisable to replace the snap ring / metal circlips that hold the driveshaft in whilst I'm replacing the seals? The part number is ADU8050 but NLA on Rimmers site. Anyone know where I can get these from??